Bagel's are too much bread for me. I eat bagel thins, which are alike a thin slice off the the top and bottom of a bagel and they are just about right to me.

Cinammon Crunch bagels are another story though.

There's no much better than a good biscuit and not much worse than a bad one.

AMDG

You've obviously never had my biscuits.

I had a biscuit at the Hotel Peabody (swankest hotel in Memphis, very famous with mallard that march to the fountain) that shattered in my hand. And then I've gotten some at restaurants that were basically dough with a little crust on the outside.

AMDG

In California, there are bagel stores everywhere and it's very easy to get a nice warm bagel. They are pretty nice.

AMDG

Ha!

I was remember what you said about biscuits when you first visited the US.

AMDG

Bagels grew on me in the course of my year in NYC.

Somehow, this is not a good image.

AMDG

I suspect someone had given bagels an excessive buildup to Mrs. Smith, so that the real thing was somewhat of a letdown.

Aye. Very heavy in the stomach, bagels, and often vended with ghastly accessories. The Panera chain trades in satisfactory bagels, satisfactory because they are very unlike what was available in Upstate New York ca. 1978.

Yes, biscuits are much better, and if you're in a hotel chain far enough South, they give you the option of the sausage gravy you never see in our part of the country.

That NY Times article I quoted from says that New York bagels were originally much smaller, around 3 ounces, about half the size they are today. That reminded me that the frozen Lender's bagels I always kept on hand when I lived in the U.S. were quite small, only about 2 ounces. So not so "heavy in the stomach", which was probably why I liked them.

American biscuits are indistinguishable from the scones my mother and grandmother used to make. It *was* a surprise to see them served with gravy.

In fact, I think over here the scone has tended to turn into a sweet, a small cake. At least they're often made and sold that way, for instance in Starbucks.

I love biscuits, with or without gravy.

I just love biscuits.

Me too.

This cupcake thing that's going on is beyond my comprehension. Five years ago when my favorite coffee shop went out of business and was replaced by a cupcake shop, I was sure it wouldn't last long. Not only is it still there, but there's another one on the corner that's catty corner to the strip mall it's in.

And where I go to an event (aside from a wedding) where there is a cake that cost $72, I can barely managed to eat it.

AMDG

Cupcakes? They're messy and they cease to be pleasant tasting when you pass a certain age (somewhere around 8).

Proper bakeries sell eclairs and cheesecake and danish and perhaps a li'l bread pudding. Pies should be made in your kitchen.

Did you also lose your taste for cake in general, Art? Seems odd to pick on cupcakes alone, though I grant they're messy.

I have a theory about the cupcake fad, btw. I think it has to do with the obsessive weight-watching and permanently restricted diets of many young or young-ish women. So in general they can't eat sweets and avoid things like traditional cakes as if they were unholy, can't allow it in the house/apartment, and so forth. The cupcake allows them to have a very limited bit of it. And in compensation for the limited amount they want it to be *exactly* right, fetchingly decorated, etc. Hence the need for a whole specialized shop.

In similar vein is the woman in the Dove chocolate commercial who dresses up, stands in a mountain stream, walks mysteriously over desert sands, cracks a bullwhip, throws her long hair around in slow motion, makes ecstatic faces, etc., to eat one tiny little bit of chocolate. "My moment" is the theme. You only get that one bite, so you got to make it count.

I wouldn't know about that. Don't know that I've had any of those, and anyway I'm probably pretty indiscriminate.

The village where we lived briefly had a "cupcake decorations shop". I don't think the craze quite took off here in the same way.

If I had a cupcake in front of me now I would not criticize it at all.

"cupcake stationery, clothing" Good grief. Out of curiosity, I just started typing "cupcake" into Google, and when I got to the second "c" one of the suggestions was...Cupcake Wars?!?

You should explore the perverse world of cooking shows. It's amazing what's out there,

AMDG

Though I'm sure it is amazing. All you have to is list the channels these days to see that there are many amazing things on TV. Amazing that anyone would watch them, amazing that anyone thought anyone would watch them.

I would love to have a Hostess cupcake make the way they used to be made when I was younger. The white part on top was definitely separate from the chocolate part and it was not the squishy mess it is now. And the cake seemed to be bigger and better, but maybe that's because I was smaller and less demanding.

AMDG

Did you also lose your taste for cake in general, Art? Seems odd to pick on cupcakes alone, though I grant they're messy.

No, I didn't entirely lose interest in cake. I just grew up in a house and have maintained a house where it was eaten infrequently. The texture of something like a bakery cake or one out of the frozen food section from Sara Lee is quite different than that of a cupcake, and the icing also differs, having proportionately less sugar.

My mother had a story on herself of her one attempt at cake baking in 1953 (while feeling no pain - it was after an evening out). All the women in my family have been pie bakers and/or cookie bakers.

Hostess cupcakes are the chocolate ones with some kind of white creamy filling and chocolate icing with a white squiggle across the top that you saw 6 million ads for on TV when you were young.

AMDG

"Hostess cupcakes are the chocolate ones with some kind of white creamy filling and chocolate icing with a white squiggle across the top"

Right -- you see them in vending machines sold in pairs. Hostess also makes an orange cupcake, same basic design, which is pretty good.

When I was a kid in the 60s and early 70s, cupcakes were primarily seen as an alternative to a proper cake, used when it might be inconvenient to cut and serve the latter. Otherwise, we seldom had them.