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Thanks for the link. We have been busy with family all day, but I will read soon.


You're welcome.

The kind of toxic femininity that I am concerned about is the kind that thrives on the toxic masculinity and enables it--women who use men's weaknesses to obtain money and power, or just women who like to have sex with powerful men. That's not to say that the problem with men's behaviour would go away if those women weren't there, but they certainly make things worse for other women.

On a more pleasant note I am glad you are posting these pictures.


It's an old, old story. There actually seems to be more of that behavior since feminism became more or less the norm. Not that feminism causes it. I guess it's partly just due to the general relaxation of sexual morals.

I think most of the world missed 50% of the significance of the Trump "grab" remark. 50% of course was that Trump is a jerk. The other 50% is that he was talking about the fact that some women would allow such things because he was rich. "When you're a star they let you do it." Not that many I think and hope.

Another type of toxic femininity is in the idea that "sexual liberation" itself is equal to "empowerment," although I'm hesitant to describe this as "femininity," really.

The combination of feminism with the overall relaxation of sexual morality serves to enable the "cad" and the "player" far more than it empowers women; the irony is that a lot of "liberated" women simply do not get this.

Absolutely true, and a consequence that was both predicted and observed as it really got going in the '70s. Though as you suggest I wouldn't describe that as having anything to do with femininity. Sometimes it looked like a male plot.

I'm sorry this post got flak on Facebook. Some people are just killjoys.

So you took it as being at least a little humorous? If so, good. That was more the mood in which it was written, but people took at as "So you mean your encounter with an annoying woman is in the same class as rape?!?!" I should have mentioned, though it might not have helped, that the TM complaint I'd been reading was not about serious and awful stuff like sexual assault, but relatively trivial things like "mansplaining".

I just think about things like the Annette Funicello beach movies, and commercial with men whistling at women, and one Coke commercial where the women are doing the same to a man, and nobody complained about any of that, and now it is heinous toxicity. This is really a schizophrenic culture.

It's not that I am defending catcalling, but where the heck have these people been?


My wife said something similar.

Of course. She is a wise woman.


If my memory is correct, most of the influential feminists back in the 1970s were definitely killjoys, and were super-sensitive with regard to male dominance and saw it in just about everything. The difference now seems to be that they're pretty much in control of the game, having secured a strong foothold first in academia and now pretty much everywhere.

That's certainly how it looks to me.

I was young and still more or less leftish in the '70s, and pretty sympathetic to the movement, or tried to be. But it was such a mixture of reasonable and crazy, e.g. Shulamith Firestone's vision of the future.

Yes, Janet, she is. :-)

The exchange on Facebook has finally convinced me that "virtue signalling" is actually a thing.

If this were Facebook I would reply with a thumbs-up and a smiley. It is indeed a thing, I think.

Isn't virtue signaling what predators do to lure in the unsuspecting?

I think it's more akin to the stuff Jesus criticized the Pharisees for: trying to make sure everybody knows you're "not as this publican."

Ha. My friend Sheila sent me a thank you note that had a stamp on the back saying it was printed on recycled paper and she drew an arrow pointing to it and wrote, "virtue-signaling stationery!"


Ah, I see this is the post that started it all. I have a hard time relating those Easter lilies to that conversation.


Actually I had sorta wanted to talk about Marillion. :-/ I'm not sure anybody read past the first section though.

Well, I hope they read the next to last paragraph. ;-).

Maybe Rob will come and talk about the music with you.


I hope they do, too. In case they didn't but are reading the comments:


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